Sunday, 4 January 2009

Thoughts with Gaza

Well done to all those who marched yesterday against Israel's bombardment of Gaza. The disproportionate actions of Israel are despicable. Violence is never the answer, and like most of the world I condemn it.

Sadly, despite most of the world calling for Israel to back off, Bush has given his backing of Israel and they have invaded Gaza.

We not only have to stop the EU's favourable trade agreement with Israel, but we should boycott and sanction Israel until it stops the disproportionate retaliation and lifts its blockade of Gaza. I also wonder how many of the weapons being used there have been made by the British - I'm sure the answer is plenty of them and we should be ashamed of ourselves for our complicitness.

My thoughts are with the people of Gaza who are suffering under the bombardment and invasion by Israel and who have suffered through Israel's blockade.

10 comments:

Independent said...

Start with knowing the facts..before you express you opinion. Because fo ignorant people, like yourself, our world is so dark.

Stuart Jeffery said...

Independent: which facts have I got wrong?

Independent said...

1. The thousands of missles that Hamas is firing from Gaza strip for the last years on Israeli civilians.

2. All the attempts to talk to Hamas, to achieve peaceful agreements, to stop civilian casualties.

3. Thousands Israeli civilians were injured (and even died) from Hamas terror acts (missiles, bombs, explosions).

4. Many other facts that show that this war was started long ago by the Hamas and was "no other choice" for Israeli authorities in order to defend its population.

Just imagine some terror org. firing missiles no London....on a daily basis....every few minutes you hear a siren and have 30 sec. to hide from the incoming missile...hide your children and protect your lives. This feeling is very hard to explain to some1 who has never felt it himself.

It's very comfortable to sit somewhere in the UK and talk about the Israeli-Arba conflict while your knowledge about this situation is limited and you've never been under massive missile attack.

I wish it could end peacefully, but for so many year Israe lis trying to negotiate with Gaza and nothing good came out of it.

In example, the negotiation went well in the West Bank (also Arabs, but not Hamas) and although there are still disagreements, they live peacefully and help each other.

Independent said...

Sometimes you have no other choice, but to completely destroy the evil (Hamas) in order to start a new and peaceful envir.

You are a nurse, right?
Then look at it as a surgery needed to cure a patient when creams and pills weren't successful in healing him...or a Radiotherapy for cancer.

Hopefully, it's not AIDS, cause then no treatment will help. :-)

Stuart Jeffery said...

Independent: I have not defended the role of Hamas and have stated that their rocket attacks are wrong in previous posts.

You have accused me of not knowing the facts without bothering to find out if I know them or not.

Many of us lived with the threat of the IRA bombing London and while not as continuous as the attacks by Hamas it was still very scary.

I suggest that you have your facts, interpretation and solutions wrong.

1. Hamas did not start this war. to suggest so is simply bizarre. As you are very well aware the conflict is long and complicated. It requires both sides to act with compassion and non-violence. Besieging Gaza was and is wrong.

2. Israel's attacks are disproportionate and therefore illegal.

3. The solution is negotiation, discussion and understanding not escalating violence.

I do not condone Hamas's actions - they should not be firing rockets at Israelis and they should stop. Israel's actions are making this less likely.

Independent said...

1. Hamas did start this war, he started firing rockets and exploding civilian buses in Israel. Read the history. Don't let the Arabic media to confuse you.

2. "both sides to act with compassion and non-violence" - Israel tried to act with compassion and negotiate but nothing helped. This war is the last resort, all other means were already use. Besieging Gaza (not was, but is) is not wrong, but necessary in order to end this conflict and solve this lasting problem (since nothing else helped so far).

2. Israel's attacks are very aproportionate because nothing else helped to stop the incoming missiles on Israeli cities. A country/state must protect its citizens by all means, and when necessary, using its army.
That's why countries, including the UK, have armies - to protects their citizens.

"...and therefore illegal" - huh!? under what law? Have oyu heard about a declaration of war? Like the war England used to fight with France long time ago? or against the Nazis? what's it also illegal?

This war is not only legal, but also inevitabe.

3. "The solution is negotiation" - Israel tried negotiate for decades. Didn't work. anything else?
"discussion and understanding" - nice words that work for intelligent human beings and not for fundamental muslims.
According to their belief, you are, my friend, an infidel and you must be killed (or converted to Islam)......is this "discussion and understanding"?

4. "... Hamas's actions - they should not be firing rockets at Israelis and they should stop" - but they don't and civilians keep dying - so what Israel should do? Keep waiting and organizing funerals?

5. "... Israel's actions are making this less likely" - after the problem will be solved (Hamas will be destroyed and peace will be achieved), will it be more likely?


6. If you want express your solidarity with the situation, try moving to Israeli southern cities with your children...then, I assume, your opinion will change radically.

Anyway, talking doesn't change much.

Derek Wall said...

ignore independent, we Greens criticise all military force including Hamas rockets.

However Israel is acting as Golith not David and unless we protest the killing spree is going to get alot worse.

thanks for blogging about the protest, incidentally the peace movement is getting busy in Israel too, 10,000 people marched in Tel Aviv.

Hamas are political extremists but decades of oppression from Israel has marginalised more moderate voices....if Gandhi was in charge of resistance to Israel he would be demonised too.

The IDF trolls will be out in force today. they are part of the ground offensive.

Stuart Jeffery said...

Derek: Thanks for your support. No matter how frustrating it is to engage with people like Independent, I think it should be done. We need to have everyone talking - not fighting.

Independent: Legal would be a proportional defence. Israel's attacks are grossly disproportionate and therefore illegal, or do you not agree with international law? Violence from both sides should stop: an eye for an eye and soon the whole world is blind.

Independent said...

You 2 talk a lot.....but that's all. If you want to stop the Hamas' missiles - go to Gaza strip and talk to Hamas, tell'em to stop. Let's see what will happen...will you succeed of not...as I already meantioned you are an infidel (according to Islam).

Sitting in front of your computer screen, in your hot and safe house and talking about some people marching somewhere to prove your point, is the simplest thing you can do. Should I say "coward"?

Stand on your legs and go to Israel, go to Gaza and se what is happening there. Don't believe everything you read/hear/see in the media. Explore the facts. Seek for the truth. Don't be anemic.

Using the same metaphor I already mentioned, will you try to cure a tumor (Hamas) with pills (talking), if year of pills changed nothing? Of course not! Cause this way your patient (Israel) will suffer and finally die. You operate (send your army) to thwart its growth (hamas missile attack), destroy its existense (eliminate Hamas seniors), pull it out of the body (eliminate Hamas members) and support the remaining healthy organizm (Israel).

Anyway, that's my opinion and as far as this conflict goes it becomes stronger and stronger.

One more thing - I think that all of you who has nothing to do with the conflict and is not going to contribute by any means (sitting in front of your computer doesn't counts), shouldn't react at all.

As one of the main ex-colonialist countries, UK, should simply shut up. During 1945 UK conquered most of Africa, south Asia and parts of Oceania, Persian Gulf, Todays Canada and Central America. This occupation were brutal and barbaric. You (and your ancestors) killed and robbed hundreds of millions of people...that's why your economy today is stable and you are rich (leave out the current sub-prime crisis). All the countries you've robbed are poor, lag behind and fighting to survive (look at Africa for instance).
So, out of all the countries, you are the last to express your opinion and speak about wars and military actions.

People in africa are begging for food while dying because of your ancestors...and your are sitting and writing.

Israel is fighting for its freedom, for its citizens' lives, defending its existance.....whereas England conquered its colonies because of pure greediness and agression. Where was the international law there? huh?

Did you forget all the terror acts that happened in London? in the subway? Wasn't it enough for you to understand how should the world deal with radical muslim terrorists? How can you still think that talking is the solution? people are dying all over the world because the are trying to negotiate with muslims...How long will it continue?

I'm tired of this endless arguments. I won't be able to persuade anyone of you, so I'll be the first to stop this discussion.


I hope your children won't know what terrorism is...but because of people like you - they probably will.

Hopefully no one of us will ever know what war is, unfortunately I already did.

Have a great life and enjoy your Thames.

Anonymous said...

How will you ever get people to vote green when you are so fucking condescending?

yer over-priviledged, under-educated and so full of yourselves it's unbelievable

and why does Israel excite you so... I wonder.